I am having a problem with missing extrusion in a print.
I have been assuming a hardware issue.
but today I noticed. I am betting its simplify 3d. well not simplify 3d but MY settings in simplify 3d
you see the flaws I have in the print line up PERFECTLY with "red marks" in simplify 3d slicer preview.
I don't believe in coincidences. that tells me the slicer is doing these flaws on purpose and that its likely my improper setting of some setting somewhere.
what settings would cause this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pos5VbEwAow
I caught it generating the error.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TteU3l2-Ibc
note it skips an entire section of the model and does NOT show this "skip" in the slicer preview!
Bad Slicer settings? what do I have to change?
Last edited by nerys on Wed Jun 22, 2016 12:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Bad Slicer settings? what do I have to change?
Ok I don't think its bad slicer settings. I think the slicer is making bad GCode.
the printer is physically CONDUCTING an action that is simply not present in the Slicer preview at all.
I finally caught it making my holes that line up with the red marks on the slicer preview and its doing it on purpose. its literally making an incomplete layer for some reason
I don't understand how I can be doing this since this is a SOLID model and S3D is generating the shape (single perimeter no infill)
one layer it goes around and lays a solid line of plastic.
the next layer it goes around and "jitters" spreading the layer (it seems to me) to make it wider??? but the print heat DOES NOT complete the layer. it stops short jumps across and goes back the other way. and low and behold the next layer lays on top of that gap it created by not going the entire way.
I am not sure how "I" can fix this since S3D is actually generating this. ???
Here is an updated video where you can see it actually doing this
also attached is a picture in the slicer SHOWING that its "complete" but the printer is not actually doing it so there is a discontinuity between the slicer preview and the gcode its feeding to my printer.
also attaching the factory file. rename to .factory of course.
Video will be ready in about 9 minutes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TteU3l2-Ibc
the printer is physically CONDUCTING an action that is simply not present in the Slicer preview at all.
I finally caught it making my holes that line up with the red marks on the slicer preview and its doing it on purpose. its literally making an incomplete layer for some reason
I don't understand how I can be doing this since this is a SOLID model and S3D is generating the shape (single perimeter no infill)
one layer it goes around and lays a solid line of plastic.
the next layer it goes around and "jitters" spreading the layer (it seems to me) to make it wider??? but the print heat DOES NOT complete the layer. it stops short jumps across and goes back the other way. and low and behold the next layer lays on top of that gap it created by not going the entire way.
I am not sure how "I" can fix this since S3D is actually generating this. ???
Here is an updated video where you can see it actually doing this
also attached is a picture in the slicer SHOWING that its "complete" but the printer is not actually doing it so there is a discontinuity between the slicer preview and the gcode its feeding to my printer.
also attaching the factory file. rename to .factory of course.
Video will be ready in about 9 minutes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TteU3l2-Ibc
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- Shy-light_Eno.zip
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Last edited by nerys on Wed Jun 22, 2016 12:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Bad Slicer settings? what do I have to change?
YouTube video cannot be viewed and the zip download is not valid!!
But...having said that, YOU need to find out what the "red marks" are. Knowing what they represent will help you understand what is going on. If you don't understand what you're seeing in the preview, then you'll never understand any defects in the printing. They're not marks in the printed model....they mean something!
But...having said that, YOU need to find out what the "red marks" are. Knowing what they represent will help you understand what is going on. If you don't understand what you're seeing in the preview, then you'll never understand any defects in the printing. They're not marks in the printed model....they mean something!
Doug Kightley
Volunteer at the National Tramway Museum http://www.tramway.co.uk
Railway modeller and webmaster at http://www.talkingtgauge.net
Volunteer at the National Tramway Museum http://www.tramway.co.uk
Railway modeller and webmaster at http://www.talkingtgauge.net
Re: Bad Slicer settings? what do I have to change?
as noted the zip is a .factory file (which oddly enough these forums will not permit you to upload)
RENAME IT from .zip to .factory
the video is still uploading. message says 9 minutes so probably 2 or 3 minutes now before it finishes.
also got a new picture! adding to second message. I FOUND the flaw in the slicer preview (its on the INSIDE)
very strange this IS the reason for the flaw but why does the slicer now show the "gap" in the wall it is actually making? (as you will see in the video)
why is it doing this and how do I stop it (without going to two perimeters I need this to be a single perimeter) assuming that has anything to do with it.
Video is now live. 4k/HD will be a few more minutes.
yes. I know I need to know what the red marks are. in fact I know what they are. they are head movements.
my question is "WHY" is it doing that. this I can not know. only the software knows this and I have not figured out how to get the software to tell me this.
in the updated video you can see its INTENTIONALLY making incomplete layers. its intentionally leaving a layer gap even though my settings as best I can tell do NOT indicate this and worse the slicer preview does NOT show this IT shows it as solid even though it clearly is not solid.
from the top down inside view you can see the "yellow/orange" filament deposition. these are the odd ones that should not even be their at all. but note even with them the slicer incorrectly shows it as being "solid" when in reality it clearly is not solid.
this is where the problem is. alas I do not know how to make the software tell me "why" its doing this. its something internal.
RENAME IT from .zip to .factory
the video is still uploading. message says 9 minutes so probably 2 or 3 minutes now before it finishes.
also got a new picture! adding to second message. I FOUND the flaw in the slicer preview (its on the INSIDE)
very strange this IS the reason for the flaw but why does the slicer now show the "gap" in the wall it is actually making? (as you will see in the video)
why is it doing this and how do I stop it (without going to two perimeters I need this to be a single perimeter) assuming that has anything to do with it.
Video is now live. 4k/HD will be a few more minutes.
yes. I know I need to know what the red marks are. in fact I know what they are. they are head movements.
my question is "WHY" is it doing that. this I can not know. only the software knows this and I have not figured out how to get the software to tell me this.
in the updated video you can see its INTENTIONALLY making incomplete layers. its intentionally leaving a layer gap even though my settings as best I can tell do NOT indicate this and worse the slicer preview does NOT show this IT shows it as solid even though it clearly is not solid.
from the top down inside view you can see the "yellow/orange" filament deposition. these are the odd ones that should not even be their at all. but note even with them the slicer incorrectly shows it as being "solid" when in reality it clearly is not solid.
this is where the problem is. alas I do not know how to make the software tell me "why" its doing this. its something internal.
Re: Bad Slicer settings? what do I have to change?
The white print looks like extrusion width/height ratio is too small and the perimeter is curling, so the perimeter on top pushes it aside. Need better layer adhesion, and for that you need to squish your layers. If you're just doing one perimeter, this can be a problem whenever you have a slope on the wall, because the extruded layer will want to push more to one side or the other, rather than being compressed into the slot-like shape that is needed.
The other video you posted is normal behavior on a slope, it looks like you're printing one perimeter and 0 infill and it's doing top solid layers for the perimeter overhead. That just turns out to be a very small amount of infill. I grabbed a random part and set up one perimeter 0 infill and here's what it looks like –>
EDIT: to stop that you can turn off top/bottom solid layers. If you need solid layers on the top/bottom of your print, you'll need to set up more than one process
The other video you posted is normal behavior on a slope, it looks like you're printing one perimeter and 0 infill and it's doing top solid layers for the perimeter overhead. That just turns out to be a very small amount of infill. I grabbed a random part and set up one perimeter 0 infill and here's what it looks like –>
EDIT: to stop that you can turn off top/bottom solid layers. If you need solid layers on the top/bottom of your print, you'll need to set up more than one process
Re: Bad Slicer settings? what do I have to change?
wait. so its treating individual layers as needed top and bottom layers?? interesting. very interesting.
I can probably safely turn off top and bottom layers on this. or add a process for the top 1mm to make it more solid and rigid.
seem like a bug that should be easy to fix in the software. when I print this in vase mode it does NOT do this. it prints perfectly. sadly you can not multi process with vase mode so this new model with a base plate can not be printed in vase mode.
why does it not go all the way to the end of the layer and why does it intentionally make a gap that does not exist in the model.
this is NOT a layer being pushed out of the way on a slow in fact in my second video the wall is nearly 90' vertical. it simply intentionally left a section empty and you can see the next not empty layer "print" over top of it forming the holes I see.
WOW how freaky is that !!!
I turned off top and bottom layers and BAM its a nice solid single perimeter wall in the slicer (and 2 hours faster printing too!)
never in a million years would I have thought THAT setting would do this (talk about unanticipated side effects :-)
nice man. thank you! I still contend that is a bug in the software for it to make those gaps and something that should be corrected but I am super happy to have found a solution!
thank you so much!
I can probably safely turn off top and bottom layers on this. or add a process for the top 1mm to make it more solid and rigid.
seem like a bug that should be easy to fix in the software. when I print this in vase mode it does NOT do this. it prints perfectly. sadly you can not multi process with vase mode so this new model with a base plate can not be printed in vase mode.
why does it not go all the way to the end of the layer and why does it intentionally make a gap that does not exist in the model.
this is NOT a layer being pushed out of the way on a slow in fact in my second video the wall is nearly 90' vertical. it simply intentionally left a section empty and you can see the next not empty layer "print" over top of it forming the holes I see.
WOW how freaky is that !!!
I turned off top and bottom layers and BAM its a nice solid single perimeter wall in the slicer (and 2 hours faster printing too!)
never in a million years would I have thought THAT setting would do this (talk about unanticipated side effects :-)
nice man. thank you! I still contend that is a bug in the software for it to make those gaps and something that should be corrected but I am super happy to have found a solution!
thank you so much!
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Re: Bad Slicer settings? what do I have to change?
I wouldn't really call it a bug, it's doing exactly what it needs to do - putting solid layers above/below your top and bottom surfaces. It's just that with no infill and a shallow slope it looks kinda odd because the area that needs to be solid is small.
Re: Bad Slicer settings? what do I have to change?
can't agree their. you can see in the video it intentionally leaves an entire section of the print "empty" and that left empty section "IS" the defects in the finished model!
if it did this top bottom stuff and ALSO finished filling in the layer I would just call it odd looking but as programmed behavior.
but it was leaving entire sections of the print UNPRINTED and not "showing" this unprinted section in the slicer preview!
the slicer preview shows those top bottom layers as being "internal" when in fact it is raising the nozzle for those layers and this is not properly displayed (as an obvious gap) in the slicer preview. at least not that I can see.
if it did this top bottom stuff and ALSO finished filling in the layer I would just call it odd looking but as programmed behavior.
but it was leaving entire sections of the print UNPRINTED and not "showing" this unprinted section in the slicer preview!
the slicer preview shows those top bottom layers as being "internal" when in fact it is raising the nozzle for those layers and this is not properly displayed (as an obvious gap) in the slicer preview. at least not that I can see.
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Rebekah_harper
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Re: Bad Slicer settings? what do I have to change?
I am not too sure but it could be something to do with the wipe and coast in the extruder tab and in the advance tab the wipe during retraction and only wipe on outer most perimeter.
if you disable them and see what happens.
if you disable them and see what happens.
Re: Bad Slicer settings? what do I have to change?
I have confirmed it was intentional gaps. The slicer was trying to apply top and bottom layers to the arching walls of the single perimeter walls. These partial top and bottom layers were just that. Partial leaving entire section of a layer empty when it would then rise for another layer and have no support under the unprinted sections of the partial layers. I removed the top and bottom layers to seperate processes and the errant partial supportnlayers were eliminated. Ie a nasty bug in the slicer but relatively easy to fox sinxe tou guys pointed me to what was causing it.
