nerys
Posts: 256
Joined: Tue Mar 29, 2016 8:47 pm

Bug? or am I doing something wrong? refuses to Vase print

I have a model. its a vase mode (of course) model. it slices fine. no issues no defects. perfect slice.

but its PETG and it pulls from the bed. I don't want to add a brim its a serious PITA to get off with PETG and for one components I can't as the model is 300x300 on a 300x300 bed.

SO I made some "brim tabs" in cad to manually add ears to hold the parts down.

This does not work however as in vase mode only the outer perimeter of the "ears" is printed. I need them filled in. but I can't add a bottom layer as this will ALSO add a bottom layer to the model itself.

SO I made the brim tabs their own separate model/stl file. I create two processes in S3D one for the ears with a single bottom layer and one for the model with no bottom layers. looks great on the slice preview. then as I printed I realized it was printing layer by layer and NOT in vase mode. I got lucky and the retractions were the same spot and hidden and it did not break the model. that would have sucked I only have one roll of this filament to use. I need to print part 3 so I decided to check my slice. sure enough part 3 is ALSO layer by layer and NOT in vase mode ???

I have BOTH processes set to vase mode and the slicer flat out refuses to do vase mode. at all.

If I slice ONLY the model process? perfect vase mode. but as soon as I try to slice both processes together sequential or continuous it flat our REFUSES to do vase mode and does the entire model layer by layer.

I really have no idea whats going on. when I try V4 it refuses to print the model "AT ALL" ie the slice preview is EMPTY. again if I slice the tab process no problem. if I slice the model process no problem. slice them both? nothing. no print at all. does not matter which order the processes are or whether I do seq or con.

I HAVE DONE mutli process and sequential vase mode literally hundreds of times before. I can't figure out what I am doing wrong here.

in V5 it simply ignores my settings outright and reverts to retractions and layer by layer refusing to do vase mode at all in multi process. if I slice ONLY the model file it slices fine.

Suggestions? (factory attached)

For now I am going to have to export 2 separate gcode files and pray it homes exactly right both times. one for the tabs and one for the vase. I can not for the life of me figure out why it refuses to do this.

It definitely has something to do with multi process "breaking" because of something I am telling it to do. when I use one single process it works perfectly fine but of course now its putting a bottom layer on BOTH models which I really do not want.
Attachments
80_Citadel_2.factory
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DrD
Posts: 74
Joined: Sun Dec 25, 2022 8:24 pm
Location: Canada

Re: Bug? or am I doing something wrong? refuses to Vase print

Nerys,

I read your post (I should call you the "King" of vase mode prints ;) ;) :D :D )

Also took a look at your .factory file. I noticed that your brims are 0.3mm high but your custom zone for
the "Brim Tabs" process was set to stop @ 0.6mm. Setting the STOP parameter to 0.3mm gives you the brim
and the first layer of your vase to be printed as "normal" based on the settings in your first process.

Custom Zone.PNG
Custom Zone.PNG (6.96 KiB) Viewed 5928 times

From 0.6mm upwards, the print occurs in vase mode (checked via the line-by-line GCODE visualizer) as defined
in the "Model" process.

I've attached a .PNG image showing the STOP zone that I'm referring to so that you can see what I'm talking about...

Hopefully this helps,

D.
You don't know what you don't know until you know (my philosophy for continued learning).
nerys
Posts: 256
Joined: Tue Mar 29, 2016 8:47 pm

Re: Bug? or am I doing something wrong? refuses to Vase print

I added that thinking it was why it was not working. it did not work either way.

When I print BOTH together in one single process it works fine. but then I have to either have no bottom layers for either component or I have to have bottom layers for both.

When I try to separate them into two processes so I can have bottom layers for one but not the other. it won't print in vase mode anymore.

I changed that to 0.3mm no change. I turned it off all together no change. I changed the process order no change.

if I print just the model. its vase model. if I print both processes it refuses to do vase mode

https://youtu.be/LLOWxWjkJCE
DrD
Posts: 74
Joined: Sun Dec 25, 2022 8:24 pm
Location: Canada

Re: Bug? or am I doing something wrong? refuses to Vase print

nerys wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 8:48 pm I added that thinking it was why it was not working. it did not work either way.

When I print BOTH together in one single process it works fine. but then I have to either have no bottom layers for either component or I have to have bottom layers for both.

When I try to separate them into two processes so I can have bottom layers for one but not the other. it won't print in vase mode anymore.

I changed that to 0.3mm no change. I turned it off all together no change. I changed the process order no change.

if I print just the model. its vase model. if I print both processes it refuses to do vase mode

https://youtu.be/LLOWxWjkJCE

Nerys,

Thanks for posting the video. Makes much more sense, now. I see what you mean with regards to the retractions.

I've toyed with your .factory file some more and I can no longer see the retractions that you'd mentioned. The key to
obtaining that result (for me) was that I set the "brim" process to stop @ 0.3mm layer height (as before) and then start
the "model" process from 0.6mm upwards...

I'm attaching the modified version of your .factory file so that you can take a look for yourself. Not sure if you'll see the
retractions or not. I'm running v5.0.2 if that helps (not sure which version you're using).

Curious to know if you're still seeing the retractions after these 2 small changes.

EDIT: Added a screenshot of the resultant 2 processes after modifying your original .factory file.

2 processes.PNG


D.
Attachments
DrD-80_Citadel_2.factory
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You don't know what you don't know until you know (my philosophy for continued learning).
nerys
Posts: 256
Joined: Tue Mar 29, 2016 8:47 pm

Re: Bug? or am I doing something wrong? refuses to Vase print

that won't work. there would be zero model for the first 0.6mm 2 whole missing layers. it would fail due to air gap printing.

I am going to try duplicating the model and making one of them part of the brim process and the other by itself then I should be able to do that without the air gap. going to try that now...
nerys
Posts: 256
Joined: Tue Mar 29, 2016 8:47 pm

Re: Bug? or am I doing something wrong? refuses to Vase print

No Joy. while doing that worked it also printed bottom layers for the model as well as the brim pads.

Grrrr
nerys
Posts: 256
Joined: Tue Mar 29, 2016 8:47 pm

Re: Bug? or am I doing something wrong? refuses to Vase print

OK its definitely a BUG of some sort. I was going nuts because I just did ANOTHER 2 model file both in vase and it slices PERFECTLY. SO here I want to see if YOU can duplicate this interesting effect.

Here is a new factory. its back to BRIM as one process stop at 0.3mm 1 bottom layer vase mode

Then SECOND process for SECOND model file no bottom layers vase mode no variable height settings.

slice it. does not work. there is a zipper line up the model. NOW. MOVE the brim pads so they are OUTSIDE the model ie NO part of the brim pads intersect with the mode (it just fits in one corner)

Now slice it again. Perfect. does exactly what its supposed to do. model in vase no zipper. WTAF for some reason having the model overlap "IS" the problem even though it should not be.

IF ANY PART of the one model touches the other model vase is broken and it has a zipper. even if ONE SINGLE disc in the brim pad just TOUCHES the model. it breaks.
Attachments
80_Citadel_2.factory
(59.14 KiB) Downloaded 26 times
DrD
Posts: 74
Joined: Sun Dec 25, 2022 8:24 pm
Location: Canada

Re: Bug? or am I doing something wrong? refuses to Vase print

nerys wrote: Tue Mar 21, 2023 12:36 am that won't work. there would be zero model for the first 0.6mm 2 whole missing layers. it would fail due to air gap printing.

I am going to try duplicating the model and making one of them part of the brim process and the other by itself then I should be able to do that without the air gap. going to try that now...
Doh! I didn't notice the air print. Nice catch.

Turning off the retraction and retooling the zones now seems to do it (no air print, either).

Updated .factory file attached. I just love your "challenges"... they're real brain-busters. ;) hehe
Attachments
DrD-try2-80_Citadel_2.factory
(59.26 KiB) Downloaded 26 times
You don't know what you don't know until you know (my philosophy for continued learning).
nerys
Posts: 256
Joined: Tue Mar 29, 2016 8:47 pm

Re: Bug? or am I doing something wrong? refuses to Vase print

yep. definitely an "intersection collision conflict" of some sort pissing off the slicing engine.

if I realign the parts and set the model to "START" printing at 0.3mm (brim is 0.3mm tall) then it slices fine. this will fail of course since it will have a 0.3mm air gab at the bottom.

I know how to fix this but I don't want to. its an F'ing pain in the you know what.

I would have to make 2 models one with the brim pads as PART of the model and then slice off the entire model above 0.3mm then take a copy of the model slice off the bottom 0.3mm (since that first 0.3mm is part of the brim model now) and then align origins.

for a one off? sure. but otherwise that is a royal freaking pain in the you know what.

Whats annoying is there is no actual conflict the parts do not actually intersect. I used a copy of the model to "cut" its footprint OUT of the brim pads. this is why I was confused that it MERGED them together in the slicer (even though I explicitly told it not to do that)
nerys
Posts: 256
Joined: Tue Mar 29, 2016 8:47 pm

Re: Bug? or am I doing something wrong? refuses to Vase print

your retractions are still their you just turned them off so you no longer "see" them in the preview. but its still stopping and printing discreet layers not vase mode. kind of like painting over the mold. there is still mold their :-) hehehe

If I desperately need a file to stay put I know how to make it work now but man is that a lot of work for a slicing bug that should be a none issue.

I hope its something they can fix easily. I can't even duplicate the models since its still going to print that stinking bottom layer. although.... maybe 3 processes? hang on got an idea.

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